My shy cat - advice?

[Snoof]

Ninja is very very shy. He's a rescue, we've had him for about a year (almost exactly) and we're sure he's been abused somewhere along the line before we got him. Additionally, people adopted him before we did and then brought him back "because he was too quiet".

Recently, he's slowed down his haring-away-at-great-speed down to ambling-comfortable-but-briskly, and when I'm the one coming in his direction he usually stops every few feet and looks back at me, then trots on a few feet and stops again to look back.

Yesterday, I saw him lying on the landing when I went up the stairs to go to bed. I stuck my arms through the banister (as you do) and gave him some petting and a few forehead scritches (his favourite ). When I got out of the bathroom I expected him to be gone (the flush usually scares him into leaving) but he was still lying there so I sat down on one of the two steps that lead to the landing proper (our house is really weird, ok? ) and gave him more cuddles. He started purring and drooling all over himself and let me put an arm around him. I did that, even though I'd never done it before, just to get him to see that people "holding" him didn't mean they would hurt him - at least not when it's me (I'm his favourite person because I have more time to spend on him than my boyfriend does, and I'm not as hyper as my 3-year-old :lol).

Every time I stopped scritching his forehead, he let me pet some other spot and then meowed. Not just a "Hey, more forehead scritchies!" meow, but also a bit inquisitive, "What are you doing?!" and a little insecure-sounding (you know you're a cat person when you find yourself ascribing detailed meaning to meows ). At last he stood up, stretched in a very relaxed sort of way, let me pet him a little bit while he stood up and then he wandered down the stairs.


Phew. So that's progress. Now for the advice. We'd been planning to foster two kittens this month, so that (once he'd beaten them into submission) he could get some social interaction (of any kind, he doesn't take kindly to the neighbourhood's grown cats on his territory and he's mostly very afraid of people - I'm the only one who gets any trust whatsoever out of him, and it's little and far between, but getting better). Cats are, after all, social animals and it seemed to me that he must be lonely, especially living in a house with beings he's desperately afraid of. We were going to keep those kittens in any situation short of Ninja hating them, but we wanted to foster them first so we could figure out if he did or not, and so we could see if he would accept them.

Kittens, because grown cats (even females) have more quirks and are less malleable, and we think it's probably important to Ninja that the house remain under his iron-pawed control. I've introduced kittens to neutered grown males before, and never had a problem. There was always, of course, a week or so where the adult did a lot of batting-away of the kitten, but after that it always ended up fine and they became friends. My very first male cat, Fred, even started beating up other cats if they bothered "his" kitten, Jake!

Now, however, Ninja's suddenly been making progress, and I'm worried about kittens being a good idea right now. What do you all think? I expected there would be some regression, perhaps, to being more antisocial again while he gets used to the kittens (we're planning to block off the ground-floor stairs so we'd always know the kittens would be on the ground floor, and so Ninja would have two whole floors to himself, and so we could leave the bathroom window open for him to go out and in - he gets absolutely miserable if he has to stay inside), but will all the careful work of the last year be completely undone?

Reason says not, and that he might regress but won't forget the careful bit of trust he and I have established between each other (he's even been coming into the lounge at night when Matt and I are sitting on the sofa, to stare at the rats and then leg it when one of them moves too fast - I'm sure he doesn't quite get the way this is supposed to go). But I would rather ask and risk getting answers I might not like (I've been looking forward to kittens a bit more than I'd like to admit ), than go blithely ahead and risk having Ninja forget all the trust we've built up.

The places he likes to lounge most are all above the ground floor, and his safest, happiest place for sleeping (the first-floor landing where the heating pipes go under the floor and heat it up, I don't blame him!) is, too. We would close the kitchen door he uses to go out and open the bathroom window a few days before we actually get the kittens, and put his food in the kitchen on the counter so the kittens wouldn't be able to get to it but so he'd have to go through their "domain" to eat, so that he'll be forced, in a sense, to socialise with them at least a little bit and so that we'll actually be able to tell how it goes.

I'm also thinking, given he's taken big steps forward in terms of socialisation, kittens at this point might just give him the extra boost he needs when he sees that they're not afraid of us and not being hurt by us. Does any of that make sense?

Thanks, and happy new year to all of you and your moggies

[dinahsmum]

Ooooh, what a dilemma

I haven't any advice - sorry. Hope someone better versed in cat psychology, or someone who has a good book, will be along soon.
And Happy New Year to you too. Good luck with whatever you decide.

[Mags]

I have never been in that position either so I'm sorry I'm unable to offer you advice. A few members on here have recently bought the Cat Confidential book, so maybe they will be able to come up with an answer for you...
A Happy New Year to you too!

[LMC]

This isn't based on any "knowledge", only experience and that limited. But to be honest, I would hold off on getting the kittens, although in your position I'd be as disappointed to hear this as you must be!

As you know, my Snowy has similar anti-social tendencies, and introducing new cats (Molly, then Amber) sent her into fits of the sulks where she wouldn't come near me for days - she wouldn't even come into the same room if one of them was there. I would build on Ninja's trust a little bit longer and wouldn't think about introducing kittens until he starts actually coming to you for affection (rather than just staying there and enjoying it when you go to him).

Unless everybody in the house is out all day every day, I'm sure he's not as lonely as you think - if he was, he'd probably be displaying some kind of destructive behaviour.

Like I said, this is just biased opinion on limited experience - but so pleased to hear Ninja is making progress - "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" !

[Snoof]

Thanks for the well-wishes everyone

LMC - you have a fair point, but Ninja will only rarely come into a room someone else is in as it is. And if someone enters a room he's in, he will vacate it posthaste.

A friend of mine who volunteers at a rescue tells me Ninja won't forget the trust we've built up, but I am expecting some regression... On the other hand, he does that anyway. He goes up and down in social behaviour, and when he's on a down he's almost the same as he was when we first got him.

I think some initial unhappiness over their presence is to be expected - and of course this may bring on a backlash for us. But I also think the overall result could be marvellous for him... So I guess I'll have to think about it for a while yet and discuss it with my boyfriend, as well. He has become more sociable over the rats, in a roundabout way (in order for him to stare at them he has to have his back turned on us, and he's gotten more comfortable doing this as he's noticed that we haven't taken advantage of it in any way). And don't forget that we'll be fostering the kittens, so if he doesn't take to them within a reasonable amount of time and his behaviour deteriorates we will be giving them back to the rescue and they will still have had the benefit of having had two kittens fostered for a period of time, while the house will go back to being Ninja's - as my friend Emma pointed out, if that happens it may even help him, by showing him that while other things may come and go, he isn't being got rid of.

We'll have to discuss it at length (me and Matt) - preferably not on an evening when there'll be much drinking involved and when I have to finish a tiger scarf (sewing it by hand) in the next hour!

Thanks for your input

[LMC]

Snowy's been going up and down for the last 11 years that she's been with me - of course, as second cat (rather than Top Cat) as Ninja would be, the situations are different.

You're obviously thinking through the effect that new kittens will have on Ninja - but bear in mind that he might, at best, ignore them and you might not be rewarded for his regression by him having two new best friends.

I'm sorry to be a bit harsh and strike a sour note here - but you asked for opinions. What you say shows that you're a very caring owner - but I think we just have to be careful not to think of our cats as having human emotions - Ninja sounds perfectly happy to me!

[Donna]

Not sure what to do. Sorry. But wish you all the best whatever you decide x

[Snoof]

LMC, I'm thinking it over very carefully. Thank you for your input - don't apologise. However, I'm discussing it with a number of other people as well, and have been doing for months. I will also go to the rescue and discuss it with the people who work there and who probably know more than I do.

I'm trying to work out if it's an acceptable risk or not, but ultimately I feel that if I get them and it doesn't work out (and we give them back, depending on whether he regresses for a little while or permanently) then at least I will have tried and he will be able to get back to his routine once we have returned the kittens.

If I don't try it, then it's possible that I'm giving up on something that would help him. When introducing an adopted (and previously abused) female Smeezer to my kitten-thrown-out-of-a-window mog, she went from only trusting me (and being quite cuddly but only if I moved very slowly) and hiding from everyone else, to being sociable and cuddly with almost everyone who came along. My friendly big cat pulled her out of her shell, it was amazing to watch.

We're still debating, but the possibility of this solving his fear of humans (and he does sound happy around me, but he is scared to death of anyone else, even my boyfriend) or providing him with company that he is currently missing out on is hard to ignore, and I feel it would be irresponsible for me not to factor it in.

Either way, we will only be fostering the kittens, if we get them. Adoption will be up for discussion when we've had a few weeks or a couple of months to observe the inter-feline interactions and see how it pans out.


Edit: Basically, your input is immensely appreciated, but that doesn't mean I'll take it all on board, if that makes sense? I'm researching this and have been for a while, and am balancing all the factors out against each other - so while it may seem that your input isn't changing my point of view, this is only because I've considered much of it before to reach the point of view I was already at.

[Donna]

Whatever you do, then I had been decided with a lot of love and care. Am sure you will do the right thing..

[Snoof]

Originally Posted by Donna

Whatever you do, then I had been decided with a lot of love and care. Am sure you will do the right thing..

Thank you, that's such a nice thing to say