Dalmatians and Labradoodles!

[angieh]

Just trying to clarify something on that buying a puppy programme last night that followed Crufts .......

I understand the horrors that have resulted in dogs being bred for certain attributes that may accentuate deformity and other problems. I understand from one part of that programme that a certain kidney problem that Dalmatians have suffered from may have been cured by cross breeding to another breed of dog, thereby restoring the necessary gene. This is presumably good news. But cross breeding Labradors and Poodles resulting in the Labradoodle is frowned upon, although originally it was the idea of an Australian man who thought to make it easier for people needing assistance dogs who wouldn't trigger allergies in the people they were trying to help. I do appreciate that the resulting puppies may have the best of both breeds, but could also have the worst and there can be no guarantee either way.

Is it just a matter of time and generations? I presume that today's pedigrees were yesterday's cross-breeds at one time?

Can anyone throw light on my confusion?

[Elaine]

Yes, You may well be right but I think the pedigree breeds of today were originally bred for a function rather than a fashion accessory which is why there is the "fit for function" debate between breeds such as the labrador, what you see in the show ring is not the same as what you see in a working lab'.
With the labradoodle, the guy who started the ball rolling was trying to help people with allergies find a service dog to help them in their daily life. I think if I remember right that he only managed to get one pup that proved to be hypoallergenic, now it's a big money fashion accessory.
There is nothing wrong with cross breeds but by making them a fashion statement, charging people a fortune and trying to sell them as something "special" is wrong. But both the buyer and the seller are at fault.

[calismum]

Agree 100% with what Elaine says.

My breed the Golden Retriever although now a pedigree or pure bred is in fact a result of quite a few crosses - Retriever, setter and spaniel. Bred together to get the best working dog for shooting on the hilly and thick bush estates of Scotland. The difference between a 'show' and a 'working Golden is quite marked, to the extent one would be forgiven for thinking they could be two different breeds. The Golden Retriever suffers from Hip dysplasia, Hereditary cataract, heart murmour and more recently OCD which is a joint problem.

My first dog was a cross breed - Border Collie/GSD. The border coliie is descended from various types of drovers dogs to the breed we see today. The main issues with BC's is Collie eye anomoly (sp) which is a blindness.

The GSD descents from various herding breeds but has now been bred for it's guarding and tracking abilities. Along the line it has developed a number of problems, the most serious being hip dysplasia and bloat due to the depth of chest.

So you see any breed that is bred to bring forward one aspect at the expense of another runs the risk of having problems of one sort or another.

A few years ago is was fashionable for the palest cream colour of Golden Retreiver. So studs and bitches were selected by colour and perhaps not as much for teperament, good hips etc. The result is though that a high number of them developed skin problems!

So, no I probably can't throw any light on your confusion - probably just add to it!

[MrsH]

I'm sure I read somewhere that the man who started it all with the labradoodle in Australia now feels he's let the genie out of the bottle and is horrified at what his well-intentioned motives have led to.

[Elaine]

I'm sure I read somewhere that the man who started it all with the labradoodle in Australia now feels he's let the genie out of the bottle and is horrified at what his well-intentioned motives have led to.

He said as much on the programe Angie is talking about too.

[babycakes]

I know someone who was offered a jack ****.........jack russel and chitzu (how ever you spell it) cross....I think they are loving the name connotations rather than the dog

[angieh]

Thanks for your comments. Yes, MrsH - the man did say on the programme that he felt he had let the genie out of the bottle and he himself has made no money out of it.

OK - hypothetically then, it's a good idea to have a dog intelligent enough to act as an assistance dog and also to have a type of coat that does not cause allergies in certain people ...... so if generations of dogs were selectively bred for this function in mind and they did not become a "fashion accessory" (which is sad) then the resulting breed, once it bred true would in fact become a pedigree animal.

The woman and her lovely dog who won Dog for Life is an example of the best sort of cross which may have just been a happy accident in his breeding.

I think what confuses me is the resistance of people to accept that hybridisation may in fact be a good thing, although there can be no guarantees generally. Mongrels used to be far more available years ago, and, like moggies, there can be increased hybrid vigour. I'm not against pedigrees especially now there seems to be much more common sense being applied to their general health.

[Velvet]

I never had a problem with crossbreeding until it all exploded with numerous crosses with the silly names & people genuinely believing they have bought a new breed. In some instances, so i have been lead to believe, people are paying more for the crosses than purebreeds

The lady that won the assistance dog award was lovely as was her very clever dog

I only watched the beginning of that programme last night, no doubt it will be repeated at some stage :)

[angieh]

Yes, I've heard about the extortionate prices involved with these so-called designer dogs. Complete nonsense and more money than sense spring to mind.

[Elaine]

But as long as stupid people think they are getting something special and are willing to pay the high price tags, stupid people will continue to breed them.

[Velvet]

But as long as stupid people think they are getting something special and are willing to pay the high price tags, stupid people will continue to breed them.

I dont think the ones breeding them are stupid, think its more a case of jumping on the band waggon to make money + lots of it:?

[Squirrel]

Speaking of designer dogs and making lots of money... Anyone hear about the Red Tibetan Mastiff puppy which became the world's most expensive dog after being sold for almost £1 million?!?

[angieh]

That's amazing Squirrel - I'd not heard about it, so had to look it up. Here's a link (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/china/8383084/1-million-for-worlds-most-expensive-dog.html) with a photo!

[Squirrel]

That's amazing Squirrel - I'd not heard about it, so had to look it up. Here's a link (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/china/8383084/1-million-for-worlds-most-expensive-dog.html) with a photo!

I know, it is a bit of a shock! :shock:

We tend to have a look at the newspapers for newsworthy articles to discuss on the course I help out at on a Weds, and this was one of the items of news picked out by the guys. They seemed to think that the pup looked like a lion more than a dog!

[angieh]

He certainly is a most unusual dog ..... and a glorious colour.

[yola]

I have to admit to have been quite interested in Labradoodles (and Poodles for that matter). Being quite badly allergic to dogs I find Labs in particular aggrievate my condition so avoid pretty well all dogs as a result. However I do actually LIKE them!

A short stay with a friend years and years ago and being exposed to her parents' toy poodles with no resulting reaction makes me think that one day I would actually like one of these dogs.

So is the consensus that it's a con? That would be a shame, but as I actually quite like the standard poodle that might be a safe option for me.

[calismum]

Poodles do not cast so they are better for people who have allergies. The labradoodle - some cast, some don't.