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dandysmom
29-08-2007, 04:47 PM
I posted this in the Daily Thread, but thought I should move it so more people could see.....
http://www.catsey.com/showthread.php?t=23411

It's post # 10 ......

Bad day with the cats yesterday!! Onyx suddenly decided to come in with me after I'd fed her...came up on the porch before I could stop her, and Leia, who'd been dozing as usual, came instantly to life, rushed threateningly at her, bushed, growling and hissing!!! Onyx crouched down in a defensive pose with her back to the house step and hissed back, then dashed into the living room with both of us in hot pursuit...I grabbed Onyx and popped her out the porch door!! Took Leia quite a while to calm down and finally have her snack; kept sniffing and sniffing where Onyx had been. And I was worried that Onyx might have been so upset at what happened that she wouldn't come back; however that was an unnecessary worry as she was waiting for me on the steps this morning as affectionate as ever. I knew Leia was jealous but never thought she'd react that badly...
Don't know where to go from here with the introduction....
Any advice...???

dinahsmum
29-08-2007, 04:51 PM
Have already replied DM but I wonder if you should get a Feliway and some rescue remedy, ready for the moment Onyx comes in to stay?
Also, you've seen me post before about the 'smell transfer'. After you've petted Onyx, transfer her smell to places in your house at cat-nose level. Pet Leia a bit, so Onyx's smell gets on Leia's coat .... maybe even furminate Onyx and leave the results somewhere Leia will come into contact?

Fran
29-08-2007, 06:08 PM
Well what a step forward Eileen, that Onyx feels so relaxed with you to venture into the house :cool: It was always going to be difficult I think introducing these two girls. Are you planning to keep Onyx as an indoor only cat too? or allow her to come in and out? I think the Feliway (which can take up to 30 days I think to work) is a good idea and the rescue remedy also. Have you the facility to keep Leia in a room whist allowing Onyx to have a sniff round your house and get familiar with the scent? and so that she doesn't feel threatened by Leia. Also Leia will then smell onyx's scent in the house later when she is let out. DM's furminator idea is a good suggestion too. Good luck Eileen but what progress! Do let us know how you get on...

babycakes
29-08-2007, 06:13 PM
Sorry didn't read that thread on the day but have done now. What a brave girl Onyx is. Well done Dandy X
Think Dm and Fran give good advice sorry nothing to add. guess it will take time

Erin
29-08-2007, 06:17 PM
sorry Eileen I dont really have any adviseto offer but I just wanted to say well done,you have done a great job with her :D its great that Onyx is feeling confident enough to go into your home.I really hope you manage to sort things out soon :D

Mags
29-08-2007, 06:39 PM
Well that is good news that Onyx has had the courage to venture into your house, Eileen but what a shame the first meeting between her and Leia was so stressful...:(

I suppose it was to be expected though, after all it is Leia's territory. Who knows, maybe this has broken the ice a bit and Leia will be a bit more interested in Onyx. The thing is now to takes things very slowly, you've had excellent advice from Fran and DM and I agree, getting Onyx's scent into the house will be the first step to introducing them properly...

You have come on in leaps and bounds with Onyx, you have gained her trust completely now. I think any one of us here would have had the same results if a 'strange' cat had walked into their house. But as we have seen many times on Catsey, there is usually a lot of spitting and hissing for a while after the first introduction but they all manage to live peacefully with each other in the end.;)

Good luck with them both Eileen, don't give up, you've done a marvellous job up to now...:D ((((hugs))))

I Love Simba
29-08-2007, 07:01 PM
Well what a step forward Eileen, that Onyx feels so relaxed with you to venture into the house :cool: It was always going to be difficult I think introducing these two girls. Are you planning to keep Onyx as an indoor only cat too? or allow her to come in and out? I think the Feliway (which can take up to 30 days I think to work) is a good idea and the rescue remedy also. Have you the facility to keep Leia in a room whist allowing Onyx to have a sniff round your house and get familiar with the scent? and so that she doesn't feel threatened by Leia. Also Leia will then smell onyx's scent in the house later when she is let out. DM's furminator idea is a good suggestion too. Good luck Eileen but what progress! Do let us know how you get on...

Well that is good news that Onyx has had the courage to venture into your house, Eileen but what a shame the first meeting between her and Leia was so stressful...:(

I suppose it was to be expected though, after all it is Leia's territory. Who knows, maybe this has broken the ice a bit and Leia will be a bit more interested in Onyx. The thing is now to takes things very slowly, you've had excellent advice from Fran and DM and I agree, getting Onyx's scent into the house will be the first step to introducing them properly...

You have come on in leaps and bounds with Onyx, you have gained her trust completely now. I think any one of us here would have had the same results if a 'strange' cat had walked into their house. But as we have seen many times on Catsey, there is usually a lot of spitting and hissing for a while after the first introduction but they all manage to live peacefully with each other in the end.;)

Good luck with them both Eileen, don't give up, you've done a marvellous job up to now...:D ((((hugs))))

I agree with you two. I had 2 cats when I was a young teenager. I had Precious first then I brought Misty into Precious's territory. It was ugly at first but it got better. What I did is, I kept Misty in the bathroom and I would only bring her out while I was able to watch the cats. If it started to get ugly I would either hold Misty or put her back in the bathroom for a little while, then let her out a little later. I kept doing that until they could get along. Wouldn't you know that they became best of buddies. The reason I chose the bathroom is because the litter box was in there. I hope that helped you some.

dandysmom
29-08-2007, 07:52 PM
Thanks all for your replys! I have already tried the fur from the comb/FURminator bit, and the rubbing of a towel with Onyx's scent around the house. I will order a Feliway and some rescue remedy tonight, hope it will help calm Leia down...I cannot believe how fierce she was!! And I'd very much like Onyx to be an indoor only cat. but having been used to going outdoors (or being outdoors!) I suspect she will want to go out; I don't like it but can live with it...
Leia has never been shut off in a room by herself; I guess I could put her in the bedroom for an hour or so while Onyx explored; but am afraid she might be unhappy at being locked away...
'Tis a problem.......:(

Kazz
29-08-2007, 07:59 PM
I just replied to this on the daily thread here it is again nothing earth shattering though.
Eileen I think the less you panic the less Leia will get stressed - and what did I tell you Onyx will be in for the winter :smile:

Try maybe stroking Leia then stroking Onyx and vice versa so they each have their scent mixed with yours - I imagine it will settle down maybe never best of friends but sure a truce can be called.

What fantastic news would it not be nice if you could make Leia understand Onyx needs a home and will not be a threat to her and make Onyx understand Leia is slightly uneasy and a little jealous of you.

But we can't they are cats and so we go slowly slowly.
Sure it will work out for the best Eileen its fate.
Karen

Elaine
29-08-2007, 08:00 PM
Some very good advice there Eileen.
As you know it took me 6 months to introduce Bernie into our home with Eva.
Leia reminds me soo much of Eva and her temperament, its scarey:lol: :lol: :lol:
Just take things as fast as Leia will let you is my best advice. Scent transferance, feliway and rescue remedy will all help a great deal but take take it all very very slowly. So slow that leia hardly notices whats going on. As Leia and Onyx are fairly food orientated, do you have a mesh door? It may also be an idea to feed on either side of this, not too close to begin with but gradually moving closer so that they can see, hear and smell eachother. The more relaxe they both become about eating and being in view, the closer you can bring the food but at the slightest spat, move back a step.
Softly softly catchy monkey;)

Elaine
29-08-2007, 08:05 PM
Thanks all for your replys! I have already tried the fur from the comb/FURminator bit, and the rubbing of a towel with Onyx's scent around the house. I will order a Feliway and some rescue remedy tonight, hope it will help calm Leia down...I cannot believe how fierce she was!! And I'd very much like Onyx to be an indoor only cat. but having been used to going outdoors (or being outdoors!) I suspect she will want to go out; I don't like it but can live with it...
Leia has never been shut off in a room by herself; I guess I could put her in the bedroom for an hour or so while Onyx explored; but am afraid she might be unhappy at being locked away...
'Tis a problem.......:(

Keep doing all the other things too Eileen, everything needs to be consistant so keep up with the scent transfer etc.
Dont confine Leia to one room only, if you can then confine Onyx to one room and then very very slowly open up the rest of the house to her. If you do it the other way round, Leia will really be pissed as its her house. Be gentle with Leia, she is a Diva but you can win her round slowly to thinking that having a friend in the house is ok. xxx

dandysmom
29-08-2007, 08:07 PM
There's no doubt they know one another's scents! You know how cats scent-mark you by rubbing their cheeks where the scent glands are on you? Well, both of them do it to me regularly! And they've smelled one anothers fur.....
Onyx is such a small little cat, and Leia was really, really angry...
Distressing, but I will soldier on and hope the Feliway helps...
Again, thanks for the kind remarks and good suggestions....

Kazz
29-08-2007, 08:12 PM
Some very good advice there Eileen.
As you know it took me 6 months to introduce Bernie into our home with Eva.
Leia reminds me soo much of Eva and her temperament, its scarey:lol: :lol: :lol:
Just take things as fast as Leia will let you is my best advice. Scent transferance, feliway and rescue remedy will all help a great deal but take take it all very very slowly. So slow that leia hardly notices whats going on. As Leia and Onyx are fairly food orientated, do you have a mesh door? It may also be an idea to feed on either side of this, not too close to begin with but gradually moving closer so that they can see, hear and smell eachother. The more relaxe they both become about eating and being in view, the closer you can bring the food but at the slightest spat, move back a step.
Softly softly catchy monkey;)

What she said.:-D

Fran
29-08-2007, 08:23 PM
Dont confine Leia to one room only, if you can then confine Onyx to one room and then very very slowly open up the rest of the house to her. If you do it the other way round, Leia will really be pissed as its her house.


I really wouldn't confine Onxy to one room. If you were planning to get her in and keep her in forever then yes but my worry is that if you confine her against her will then she will be reluctant to come back in...

dandysmom
29-08-2007, 08:44 PM
And the "one room" might be a problem. The downstairs is what you would call I guess open plan: hall goes directly to the kitchen, living room is off the hall and leads to the dining room and the little plant room. The only room downstairs with a door is the very, very small downstairs bathroom. The bedrooms and upstairs bath all have doors of course, but that would mean carrying her upstairs...I don't think the one room is going to be too feasible...
Onyx was waiting for her tea and did the leg-twining, face stropping bit, but made no attempt to come in today; Leia is guarding her porch and glaring thru the screens...
Feliway to the rescue...? :roll:

Mags
29-08-2007, 08:49 PM
You can but give the Feliway a try Eileen, it may do the trick...;)

dinahsmum
30-08-2007, 08:33 AM
They'll sort it out Eileen. Don't be too alarmed by the hissing and spitting (even if you are amazed that your dignified Leia even knows such language, never mind uses it! :) ) It's her only language - they can't go down the pub together and talk through how they can live together, or have a cup of tea and a scone and a nice chat - so I'd be inclined to let her/them get on with it in feline fashion. I also think that it would be better (if it's possible) not to have a 10 point action plan. Get the Feliway and RR, and get that running, but leave the protagonists to work it out cat-style, without you arranging furniture/open or closed doors etc. Easy to say, more difficult to do :?
Stay cool, don't allow yourself to get stressed. You have done sooooo well to get to this point - it will improve even more.
Well done! :) Good Job! :)

mable1718
30-08-2007, 08:42 AM
Im so sorry but I do not know much about this sort of thing so I hope everyones advice has helped

dandysmom
30-08-2007, 04:07 PM
They'll sort it out Eileen. Don't be too alarmed by the hissing and spitting (even if you are amazed that your dignified Leia even knows such language, never mind uses it! :) ) It's her only language - they can't go down the pub together and talk through how they can live together, or have a cup of tea and a scone and a nice chat - so I'd be inclined to let her/them get on with it in feline fashion. I also think that it would be better (if it's possible) not to have a 10 point action plan. Get the Feliway and RR, and get that running, but leave the protagonists to work it out cat-style, without you arranging furniture/open or closed doors etc. Easy to say, more difficult to do :?
Stay cool, don't allow yourself to get stressed. You have done sooooo well to get to this point - it will improve even more.
Well done! :) Good Job! :)
Thanks for your good common sense answer....I do tend to worry too much and imagine "what if?"....I could put up with the hissing/spitting: Misty did that when Patches came .... but it's an actual cat fight that has me worried, with the size disparity. I will keep a large beach towel and a spray bottle of water handy if and when ......:roll:

Elaine
30-08-2007, 04:13 PM
I'm sorry but I disagree with just letting them "get on with it" at this stage.
That was exactly the advice we were given when Bernie arrived and I already had the feliway and RR on the go for his arrival.
The result for us letting them get on with it was hell!!! Eva got into such a state, and she is a fair bit bigger than Bernie, that she messed herself several times and at one stage began to hyperventilate. I know that some cats may well just have a small spat and work out the pecking order, Winston was always like that and accepted other cats fairly well but Eva is not Winston.
We had to go back to the drawing board and take things as slowly as Eva allowed us in order for her to accept him. Some cats can be so territorial that they WILL hurt the other and to my mind introductions have to be taken seriously and gently.

random
30-08-2007, 04:21 PM
I don't know what to suggest, all of mine have accepted newbie readily except tabs, she took about 8 months to accept the others but was just very slowly slowly, but there was never any real fights, they just kept out of each others way.

Now if it was dogs i'd have 101 things to try. :roll: :lol:

Good luck with them though, the advice given has been good, I agree with getting each others loose fur and leaving it around the 'other's' territory, and maybe a bit of litter, try and get onyx to go in a litter and then bring it inside to Leia's tray.

dandysmom
30-08-2007, 04:35 PM
I don't know what to suggest, all of mine have accepted newbie readily except tabs, she took about 8 months to accept the others but was just very slowly slowly, but there was never any real fights, they just kept out of each others way.

Now if it was dogs i'd have 101 things to try. :roll: :lol:

Good luck with them though, the advice given has been good, I agree with getting each others loose fur and leaving it around the 'other's' territory, and maybe a bit of litter, try and get onyx to go in a litter and then bring it inside to Leia's tray.

That sounds like a great idea, except I have no idea where she toilets!! :roll:

Elaine
30-08-2007, 04:40 PM
Lets look at it from Leia's point of view, she has lived in that house since she was a kitten right? Thats her domain, she hasnt known anything else. The sudden sight, sound and smell of Onyx in her house would be the equivalent of us waking in the middle of the night to find some one sitting in your lounge, on your sofa, watching your telly:shock:
How would you feel? Frightened, angry, apprehensive, defensive? All of those I'd imagine, these are primitive emotions and all ones that cats share.
Surely better to get to know some one before allowing them into your personal space and for me that takes time.

Elaine
30-08-2007, 04:48 PM
http://wizz-catz.co.uk/introducing.html