Pebbles is going to have to go back to the vets again [Archive]

Booktigger

09-07-2006, 10:38 PM

It is 6 weeks since her leg removal, and she is doing really well, she has the occasional struggle to get on the bed but that is about it really - I will post some pics later. She is up this week for her first weigh in since it, to check that she hasn't put too much on, but her nose is looking worse than it has ever done http://catchat.org/discus/clipart/sad.gif. I rang the vets earlier this week, as it was looking bad then, and it is looking even worse now, and her 'nose vet' is on Mat leave till about Christmastime, so at the moment, there isn't anyone knowledgable enough about it, they were hoping that one of the locums would know something about it and could see her for me. If not, I honestly dont know where we are going to go. Everytime one thing is sorted, another thing rears its ugly head, and yet again I am struggling to see the light at the end of the tunnel, and not made easier by the fact that until we know what these locums are like, there isn't a vet at my practice who can deal with it.

Here are a couple of pics - a previous one of her nose

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b45/booktigger/nosecloseupaftercream.jpg

and one taken today

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b45/booktigger/nosecloseup-1.jpg

Hreow

10-07-2006, 06:37 AM

Let's hope one of the locums does know.
Glad to hear she's doing well on three legs, though. She seems to have settled down after that operation quite well. Real shame that her nose has gotten worse. : /

Mags

10-07-2006, 01:23 PM

Sorry to hear Pebbles' nose has got worse....I hope they can do something about it BT.....

Fran

10-07-2006, 02:11 PM

Fingers crossed that something can be done quickly for Pebbles x

Sweet

10-07-2006, 02:49 PM

Sending Pebbles a ((((((hug)))))) x

Donna

10-07-2006, 04:05 PM

Good luck when you get to see the vet BT x

Kim

10-07-2006, 07:55 PM

Ah poor Pebbles. Hope they can do something for her. Glad to hear she is managing well on 3 legs!

Booktigger

10-07-2006, 09:30 PM

Well, I spoke to the vet nurse today, who was goign to have a chat with the vet and get back to me, although I am still waiting. She did say though, that if there is no one there who can deal with it, they would have to refer her. I Really dont want to go down the specialist route though, it is a long journey, and I am really good at getting lost everytime I try and go somewhere new, however easy it is supposed to be!!

smithdouglaswood

10-07-2006, 10:38 PM

Sorry about her nose, hopefully one of the locums will have a good idea what is wrong.

Glad that she is coping well with 3 legs, poor Pebbles.

They do like us worrying.

Take Care.
Angie and the gang

MrsH

10-07-2006, 11:07 PM

So sorry to hear that her nose is worse, hope you get some answers soon.

dandysmom

11-07-2006, 02:37 AM

That's sad news; especially as she's doing so well on 3 legs. Hope one of the locums will be sble to help...is there anyone who could drive with you if you do have to see a specialist? As a person with a terrible sense of direction I can empathize with you about getting lost...:roll:

borderdawn

11-07-2006, 06:41 AM

Poor Pebbles, excuse if I have missed something, has she had a diagnosis on this problem? Is she regularly vaccinated?
Dawn.

Booktigger

11-07-2006, 03:10 PM

BD - she saw a different vet in Feb time, and was diagnosed with pre-cancerous scabs due to sun damage. Not sure what being vaccinated has to do with it, as they are on her nose. I have had her for 17months, not sure about vaccinations before but would doubt it, so I started the vaccs last year, and she got her booster this year. The vet has just rang, and the only thing that she can physically do for her is cryotherapy. This was mentioned by the other vet earlier in the year, and I did some research on it and decided not to do it, as there are no guarantees it will work, and it might not last all that long, plus I know of a person who said it is uncomfortable. My other concern at doing it with her is that she will need a mild sedation every time they do the treatment, and we would be looking at a minimum of 3 treatments 2 weeks apart - I have expressed my concern about it to the vet, who said it was an extremely mild one so should have no side effects - she has already had 3 sedations this year, and blood tests 6 months apart as both times the vet was convinced she had kidney probs. OTher than that, options are radiotherapy, which isn't an option due to distance, or take her to the specialist, which is in Chorlton, and the other side of Manchester to me, so I would get horrendously lost, so dont really want to go down that route either. So still no idea what I am goign to do, the vet says that we should try the cryotherapy as we wont know how effective it is till we have tried it, but she didn't really convince me (and got loads of questions due to the research i had done!!)

borderdawn

11-07-2006, 06:23 PM

Over vaccination causes huge problems in Cats aswell as Dogs, things like Dermoid Lupus cause sores on the nose that flare up and reduce at times, I wondered by the way you were talking if the Vets didnt know what it was and it could of been a possibility. Hope she is ok.
Dawn.

Booktigger

11-07-2006, 07:10 PM

Ah right. I do highly doubt that she has been over vaccinated, her first owner obviously never took her back for the pin removal, and when she was taken from her second owner, she had to go straight to the vet as she had a skin prob and conjunctivitis. I have been thinking a lot since my last post, and at the moment I just dont think I can put her through any more vet visits at the moment, and esp not put her through treatment that would require yet more sedation, might not work, and there is a chance it will return after the treatment. And the trip to the specialist is a minimum of 50 mins each way, prob more so with my lack of direction, so not sure I want to push that either. And at the moment, she is still acting the same, so I wonder if they bother me more than her.

Hreow

11-07-2006, 08:06 PM

Stick it on your todo-list for her. If she's not that bothered and would mind the vet trips, seems like the best thing at the moment?

dandysmom

11-07-2006, 08:29 PM

I have had cryotherapy twice for pre-cancerous facial lesions, and it is NOT uncomfortable...stings a bit then scabs over, later scab falls off, no scar. No local anaesthesia required. If Pebbles were mine, I'd be inclined to wait and see..that was an interesting point about the lupus...

Booktigger

11-07-2006, 09:52 PM

Interesting that you say it isn't uncomfortable, as someone on another forum said it was. The only reason why sedation is needed for PEbbles is that she dislikes any part of her face (apart from her ears) being touched, so the vet has no chance of doing it and her stay still - it would normally be done without. So, as she would need a mild sedation, she would also need to be pr3e-starved and spend part of the day at the vets. At the moment, I just dont think it is fair on her, I may reconsider this decision in a few months, but while she isn't seeming in pain with it, then I am going to leave her to get over everything she has already been through. I just wish that someone could look at it and say whether they are still pre-cancerous or not, as that might affect my decision.

dandysmom

11-07-2006, 10:57 PM

Believe me. BH, I have a really low pain threshold & am a coward about needles, etc., so when I say it wasn't uncomfortable...it really wasn't! Was scared to death that it would hurt, & it was over so quickly with only a little sting that I couldn't believe it!! Poor Pebbles; hope very much that it gets no worse & she has a respite from vet visits for a while!

Booktigger

13-07-2006, 09:19 PM

She went for her weigh in today, and has lost weight :( She was 3.99 just after the amputation and 7 weeks on is down to 3.60 - not a massive amount I know, but still enough to worry me, esp as she has been eating well. Will have to see what happens when she goes back in 5 weeks time, fingers crossed I can get her to put some weight on by then. I decided yesterday that if she had lost weight (I had a dream she lost 1/4 kg, not far off) then not going through with treatment at hte moment was the right thing to do. Teh vet looked at them and agreed that they are looking bigger, but didn't push me when I Said that I thought Pebbles had had enough this year, and that I wasn't going to go through with it, esp not as they dont bother her.

Hreow

13-07-2006, 10:29 PM

Has she lost weight because she needs to do more work to get around on three legs? Extra exercise will take weight off, then you get some back (muscles weigh more).

Booktigger

15-07-2006, 08:17 AM

I hope it is something like that - do you think that can explain such a big loss though? I do hope she has gone up again by her next weigh in, i was hoping to have her on every other month weigh ins, rather than every month.

Hreow

15-07-2006, 10:01 AM

I think it can. Just. She will have felt a bit disorientated with everything being slightly different at home while getting used to three legs. That would have put any of my past cats off their food a bit. Combine that with getting used to,not only carrying more weight per leg, but also using muscles she hasn't up to now (or used in a different way) , I'd say it's a fair assumption. But again - you know your cat - you *know* if there is something you should worry about.

Booktigger

15-07-2006, 07:00 PM

She hasn't really been off her food, and that is why I was puzzled at such a weight loss - I had expected some, as I had thought her spine was feeling a bit bony, but everytime I move the biscuit jar, she is sitting looking at me expectantly, and I do tend to give in with her (as I do with Molly, as they both need to put weight on). I think it is more of a concern with her as we have always had weight issues, I had hoped that the amputation would have changed things, but obviously not.

Hreow

15-07-2006, 07:18 PM

Give her a chance, it's not been *that* long since the op. :grin:
I can just imagine her magically appearing and looking expectant when you move that jar. :-)

Booktigger

15-07-2006, 07:27 PM

I know, its just that she was very nearly 4kg with only 3 legs, so I thought that we might have got over the weight issue, so to find out 7 weeks later she has lost 0.4kg is a bit worrying. Will just have to try giving her extra rations I think, and maybe a/d once a week. I wouldn't say magically appearing - she practically lives in my bedroom, so eats in there too, and all her food is in here. She has been outside again today, and seemed to really enjoy herself, had a couple of catnip leaves and a play too. And am just going to pray that her scabs are still pre cancerous and that they stay like that for a long time, as the vet said there are concerns about sinus probs after a nose removal, so prob wouldn't put her through that if they ever do turn.

Hreow

15-07-2006, 07:37 PM

Much better if she can live a happy life for the years she has left, without more operations. She does sound happy and well in herself.

Booktigger

15-07-2006, 08:03 PM

That is how I am lookign at it, and jsut hope that it is years that she has left. Poor Ginger has already outlived a few cats!!

Booktigger

23-07-2006, 04:45 PM

One of the latest scabs is looking bigger now, and I do still keep doubting my decision not to go through with the cryotherapy, despite the reasons being the research I did shows it only has a 70% chance of working - and then only if the scabs are under 1cm in diameter (not sure how big hers are), the median disease free interval is 14 months, and she would need a sedation for each lot of treatment - the original figure mentioned was 3, and I don't think i can afford to put her through anything else that might stress her and cause her weight to go down even more - she is nearly back at the weight she was when seh came 18 months ago, and while she only has 3 legs now, she didn't lose all that much after the op.

dinahsmum

23-07-2006, 07:16 PM

You know Pebbles better than anyone; the vet will know the medical theory ... you've got to meld the two I guess?
Good luck!

Jac

23-07-2006, 07:25 PM

I have been in a similar situation, only it was a dog. You know your cat. My advise is go with your heart. I have sent you a pm.
Thinking about you both.
Jac xx

Booktigger

23-07-2006, 10:30 PM

I am still not comfortable with my decision, but yet when I look at my reasons for not going through with it, I know they are good reasons not to put her through anything else - I think I just want to see someone who will be able to either say 'yes, they are still pre-cancerous, or no, they have turned'. Might ring the vet the rescue use tomorrow, and see if they will see her for me - is that allowed? I have just reminded myself that she has had 3 ops while I have had her - she was the only cat I have had a dental done on that has had to go back, she had complications after the second that 3 vets had never seen, and the third (and most worrying) was she was put on a drip during the op and still took quite a while to come round - while her blood tests earlier this year showed no organ probs, she has had two ops and a sedation for x-rays since then, I have a feeling I am going to end up getting her blood tested again this year, esp if she does continue to lose weight. She is happy in herself though, which is a good thing. My friend (who i got her off) was round earlier - PEbbles sat on the stairs looking haughty, and when my friend stood up to say hello to her, she turned her head away, and refused to acknowledge her - her ears twitched, but she wouldn't look at her - she would look at me though!! It was incredibly funny - she has only seen her once since her amputation though, and didn't come round as much while we were having all the issues. Thanks for the pm Jac.

Hreow

24-07-2006, 07:56 AM

I can't think of a single thing you've done wrong so far. You've weighed the options and have chosen the path that will give her the best life. You reassess now and then to make sure it's still the smoothest one. Of course you don't want to lose her! Especially not if it's to something that may perhaps have been treatable as that will be very hard for you, but you've only taken away the extra *uncomfortable* years she *may* have had, none of the good bits of happy cat-life.

Booktigger

24-07-2006, 08:06 AM

Thank you very much, that makes me feel a lot better. Am still going to ring the other vet, as I just want someone to say if it has turned cancerous or not, I am still not going to go through with treatment. I doubt if it has turned that I will put her through a nose removal, there is a risk of sinus probs (no point taking cancer away if you are going to leave the poor cat with a lifetime of sinus issues) and I just dont want to put her through anohter op at this point in time.

Hreow

24-07-2006, 08:32 AM

Knowing what you are dealing with is always much better. :grin: Hope you can get a second opinion without too much bother.

dandysmom

24-07-2006, 08:40 PM

Seems to me you've made all the right decisions for Pebbles. Her quality of life is what it really comes down to in te end. Good luck with the second opinion!

Booktigger

26-07-2006, 07:52 AM

i have spoken to the other vet, and they are willing to see her for me to see what they can say. From how they were questioning me, I think they are quite surprised that my vet hasn't done a biopsy to confirm this, and also that they haven't put her on steroids, they say it is normal for this kind of thing and works well. So we are going tomorrow night (hope it isn't too hot by the time we go) and hopefully I will have some answers then. Not sure if steroids will be appropriate as she is such a nightmare to pill!

Booktigger

28-07-2006, 08:03 AM

the new vet was lovely (thinking of changing), and said that it is mild (he isn't 100% sure it is SCC without a biopsy, and as it is so mild, doesn't want to do it yet), and hopefully with steroids it can be kept at bay for years. If the injection he gave her last night doesn't work, then we might have to do a biopsy though!!

Hreow

28-07-2006, 10:32 AM

Glad you finally found a lovely vet! Makes everyones life so much easier. And *great* news about the nose!! So happy for you both. You can relax and enjoy things again.

dandysmom

28-07-2006, 07:54 PM

That's wonderful news, BT!!! Let's hope the steroids will do the trick & that she has many more happy and healthy years...new vet sounds like a winner!

Mags

28-07-2006, 09:21 PM

Great news BT......hope the steroids will help Pebbles.....

Fran

28-07-2006, 09:43 PM

Great news BT!! Hope the steroids help

Booktigger

05-08-2006, 03:50 PM

Noticed last night that she was breathing really noisily again. The redness has gone from her nose, but the scabs haven't. She is due back on Thurs for the next jab, so will have to see what the vet has to say about her - I do hope it is positive.

borderdawn

05-08-2006, 04:51 PM

Donna

05-08-2006, 04:53 PM

Fingers crossed again for Pebbles x

Booktigger

06-08-2006, 04:19 PM

Part of the redness is back today :( And her remaining back leg looks a bit thin and sunken, hopefully I am just imagining that after looking at Tom!! I will try giving her extra rations (she always shows an interest everytime the biscuit jar is picked up, so not too hard!!), and her and Molly had a tin of a/d and some biscuits between them for breakfast, might do that once a week for them. She has been playing today though, which is a good thing, and she was being awkward at coming home last night and did run away from me twice - couldn't catch her either time!!!

Booktigger

11-08-2006, 07:00 PM

Well, the vet seems quite happy with her, he gave her a different injection, and wanted to see her in 2 weeks to see how this one has worked. Apparently the scabs will just drop off - or I Can pick them off, but i like my fingers!! She has put on a bit of weight too, she is now up to 3.6 rather than 3.4, so it is looking positive for her. Ginger has lost a bit of weight too, although Tom has put some on - the vet said they were both big boys, so that and their age means he doesnt' think I should worry about them losing much more, but just monitor to make sure they dont put any on. So a fairly good (and cheap) vet visit!!